November 15, 2016

How to Generate Leads Using Social Media in the Real Estate Space

Episode 22:

Shawn Mandan has been a real estate investor for over a decade now. After completing his BBA from the University of Houston, Shawn decided to become an entrepreneur rather than a company man. With his strong technical background, as well as having a creative mind, Shawn found unique ways to market for leads. This opened the doors to many real estate opportunities, as well as new contacts who looked to him for help. As he continued on, he found more and more investors looking for new ways to market for motivated sellers, buyers, as well as private money lender leads.

With the rise of social networking, Shawn quickly became a master at generating leads using social media – particularly in real estate.

What you’ll learn about in this episode:

  • Shawn’s background and how he got into real estate
  • Why getting your start in real estate is best done with no money
  • Shawn’s real estate lead machine that is fueled by social media
  • How to generate leads using social media in the real estate space
  • Why Shawn wants to be the person to offer free information
  • The value of an email address
  • Shawn’s lead optimization plan: what it is, how it works, and why it can take a while to bring in results
  • Adapting your strategies as time changes
  • Working with investors in other locations than just your own
  • What Shawn’s deals usually look like
  • Shawn’s best and worst deals
  • Why you need to do your research — and why mentors can help you avoid bad mistakes
  • Why you should never leave a lead behind — even when they tell you no



Mitch: This is Mitch, and welcome to the Real Estate Investor Summit podcast. Today, we’re going to get you some Shawn Mandan. This guy’s going to talk to us today about lead optimization, and how to generate leads to buy houses. Because, we all know that it starts with a great deal. Everything starts with a great deal. Nothing in this creative real estate business happens until you get a deal. And so, what a better conversation to have than how to generate leads.

Now, you’ll be able to reach this segment and learn more about Shawn Mandan at And, just for the record, just spell Shawn’s first name, S-H-A-W-N, again M-A-N-D-A-N. So, That’ll be in the show notes there for you.

And, I can’t wait to get your guys rolling on this, because I know it’s a tough market out there. It’s been a tough market, because real estate is really, really hot, and finding distressed deals — you know, there has never been more competition, and there’s never been a hotter market for selling. So, we’ve get 2 things working against us.

That being said, you know, I picked up just under a 100 houses in 2015, and I’m on pace for about the same in 2016. It can be done,. You’ve just got to hone your skills, and get off the beaten path, and go the extra mile and do what people aren’t willing to do.

So, with no further ado, hey, Shawn Mandan. How are you doing?

Shawn: I’m doing good. I’m doing good. Thank you for having me, Mitch.

Mitch: Oh well, I’m going to let you tell the audience a little bit about how you got started, who you are and the reasons why you’re on this call is because of the things you’ve done and what you’ve accomplished. So, tell me who you are and what you’ve done, and let us find out some specifics about Shawn Mandan.  

Shawn: Alright. Basically, my name is Shawn Mandan. I’m with Areis. A-R-E-I-S. I got started right after college. Like many college graduates, you know, when I graduated with my degree in marketing and management, I was just confused on what to do next. I’ve always been told that real estate was the place to make money. All my parents’ friends, they were buying properties. They were making money. They were renting out houses and apartments. And, I was like, “Hey, I want to be at the same place that they’re at.”

So, I basically started by, you know, going to the little meetings and stuff to get a little bit more information on how it works. I did that, and did whatever every other investor does. You know, I sent out postcards. I did the bandit signs. You know, I tried to get the off market properties, rentals, flips.

I finally came across, you know, one of the properties that I liked. It was a small little condo. I got my credit cards together. I took out some money. I bought my property, eventually started paying it down. Once I paid that down, I went and moved on to the next property, and so on and so forth. That’s pretty much me in a nutshell.

A lot of people say that, “Hey, I don’t have money to get started in real estate.” Honestly, you don’t need much. You just need motivation, and, you know, you’ve got to go out there, and you’ve got to actually take a chance.

Mitch: Who has money when you’re starting out, right? No one has the money. 

Shawn: Exactly.

Mitch: And, if they do have money when they start out, you probably don’t have it after the first 6 months, because you don’t know what you are doing. The best way to learn this business, if you have money, is to put your money away, and learn how to do it without any money, and then you’ll know that you know how to do it.

And, then go and get your money. I always tell people that. You’ve got a lot of money? Go put it in a CD for 2 years, and then let’s learn how to do this business with no money. If you can do that, then congratulations. You can go  use your own money, now.

Because, if you start using your own money right upfront, and you don’t have this rough and tumble boot camp kind of style education upfront, you’re just going to lose the money you have. So, why don’t you go out there and learn how to do that without the money.

So, I went out there broke. You went out there broke. And so, what happened after that?

Shawn: So, basically after that, I mean, it’s been a while. I’m not going to lie. It’s not easy. It’s a bumpy road. On my first couple of properties, did I lose some money? Did I make mistakes? Yes, I did. But, you know, you shouldn’t let those mistakes bring you down. You should learn from those mistakes.

I mean, you can pay somebody to teach you how to do this, too. And, you know, you’ll get information but, if you make a mistake, just think of it as you paid somebody to learn it. And, just move forward from there. You know, but you have to also know when to draw your line.

Mitch: So, you’re out there. And, how did you start generating leads in the beginning? What were you doing to get you leads, and then how’s that transformed?

Shawn: So, basically, what I started doing was, when I first started generating my leads, it was through sending out postcards, doing some bandit signs. I’ll be honest, bandit signs did not get me much. My postcards were my main lead generators back then.

And then, as time progressed, it just got harder and harder for me to get a lead. There was so much competition out there, you know. I ended up hitting the same people that other investors were hitting up. It took me almost, I would say, 5 years after I did my first deal that, when I started to implement my real estate lead machine.

What I started doing was I started using social media. You know, what I would do is I would go ahead and blast out on social media. I would blast out on, like Twitter and Facebook, “Hey, you know, this is what I do. If you like what I do, or if you’re in a same scenario that I am, hit me up.”

It’s basically, free leads, because what’s going to end up happening is, let’s say I throw a message out there on Facebook. You know, my friends, they like it. They share it. Their friends see it, and so on and so forth. It’s a never ending thing.

The other advantage is they’re not paying for it. If you get a lead from it, great. Follow up on that. If you don’t get a lead from it, at least you’re getting exposure out there. You’re building your brand. You’re building yourself.

That’s basically what my real estate lead machine is. It’s a marketing machine that’s out there that’s working for me instead of me working on it.

Mitch: So, I love the idea of social media, because there’s so much to learn out there. You can also waste a lot of time on social media, if you don’t know exactly what you are doing. So, what are a couple of the more prominent places? I mean, are you using the Facebook sales pages, or what do they call it, Facebook Market? What is it called?

Shawn: Basically, you know, I haven’t — I’ll be honest. I haven’t paid for much marketing on Facebook. I’ve done a little bit here and there. Mostly what I do is I’ll join pages. I’ll like other investors that are out there. I’ll follow them. And then, what ends up happening is, once I do that, I get people that are following me back.

For example, Twitter. and the reason I use social media now is because everybody is on it. That’s what the world is moving to. I mean, look at all the big companies; Amazon, Walmart, Best Buy. They’re all on there.

I don’t have to market to a specific client. I just market to everybody. You know, I’ll try to go out there, and I’ll try to just blast it out there,”Hey, if you’re going through a tough time. You’re going through a divorce. You don’t know what to do, come to me for information. I don’t necessarily want to buy your house. Come to me for information. I’m going to help you avoid that situation. Come to me for answers. And, if I help you out, great. Hey, you know, I made a friend.

“If down the road you have somebody that you know that’s in that situation, give them the information that they need. If it helps them out, great. If it doesn’t and you need me as a last resort…” Since I’m fresh on their mind, they’re going to contact me. They’re going to say,”Hey, Shawn. Come in. Help me out. Buy my house. I need to move it. I need to move on with my life.” You know, that’s the motto that I’m going after.

Mitch: So many people out there don’t understand the theory of “go there to help first.” And, “buy the house,” put it at the end of the list. Go there to be of service. Because, that always shine through.

People know when you are there, they smell  blood in the water. But,when you’re there to see if you can’t get them into a wrap, and get them someplace safe, you get them to where — maybe they really don’t want to lose their house. Well, how can we help you keep your house?

And, that’s one of the things I pitch it my website to buy houses is that I’ll come there and see if there’s any way you can keep your house, if that’s what you want to do. Let’s talk, put my brain to how do you keep your house, if that’s what you want to do.

Shawn: Exactly. 

Mitch: And then, if we run out of options there, I don’t have to tell them that there’s not another choice. They come to the conclusion themselves, you know. And, so who are they going to want to work with? Everyone else out there is trying to, you know, steal their house, and don’t care what happens to them.

You know, if it becomes apparent that they need to move from, or transition from this house, now it is, “What do we need — if we’re going to have to make a transition, how can I help you make the transition? Do you have a place to go? Do I need to help you find a place to go? Do you need a little money to get there? You know, how can I be of service, if you gonna have to make the transition? And that’s the conclusion that you’ve come to. So, where else can I be of service?” And so…

Shawn: Exactly.

Mitch: You’re actually going to get the house, right? I think you hit the nail on the head there, and I really like that about you is that, you’re there to be of service.

Shawn: Yeah. My main thing, is I’m going to provide free information to people to help them get out of their situation. I want to be the last resort. If they’re stuck, that’s when I want to go ahead and step in.

What I do is, I get them to go ahead opt-in by giving them free information, and the main thing that I get out of that is I get their email address. Investors and people don’t understand how important an email address is.

Once I get that, I provide them with a lead magnet. I get them that information that they need to help them with their situation. And, since I’m an expert on that subject matter that they’re facing, it is building trust on both sides. They’re getting the information that they need, and I’m getting the information that I need.

Then, what I do, is I’ll hit them a series of emails, constantly checking up on them, saying, “How are you doing? Do you still need my help? I know that you were in a certain situation, you know, you were having this issue. Have you resolved that issue?”  If it helps them, great. If not, I’ll tell them, “Hey, basically refer me over to somebody else that may need it. You know, possibly you’ll get a monetary compensation out of it.” It’s a win-win on both sides.

And then, if they say, “Hey, I need your help. I can’t get out of my situation.”, I jump in and I take care of my lead. You know, my main intention at the end of the day is to help people get out of their sticky situations, not just to profit from them. If my information benefited them, then I’m happy, because that’s what I set out to do. If their situation is beyond their control, then that’s when I can step in and help them out.

You know, that’s a snapshot of what my lead optimization plan is. And everybody that flips, they can go check it out on my website. I clearly put it out there for free. There’s no charge for this. It’s on, and that’s our website. And, that’s pretty much what my lead optimization plan is.

Mitch: And so, can you get more specific about how your lead optimization plan works? I mean, how and what kind of amount of leads can you expect? Does it take a while to build up? Tell us a little more in depth about what it does.

Shawn: Got you. So, the lead optimization plan, basically what it’s going to do is, once I set up that series of emails, I’m just keeping them entertained, I’m keeping them — I’m building that trust with them.

Now, is this going to automatically generate leads right away? No, it’s not. You know, it takes a while, and not everybody is in a situation where they need to get rid of their house right away. Some people are just starting, you know, so it is not going to necessarily bring in the leads right away.

In the meantime, what do you do? You continue to do the traditional marketing. You continue to send out postcards. This is supposed to be on top of what you’re currently doing. The reason that it’s more beneficial is you’re not wasting that much time and money on this, because one of the things that I’m going to teach you down the road is how to automate.

You want to have real estate work for you, instead of you working for real estate. Basically, you still want to send out some of these postcards. Bandit signs — You know honestly, I’ve been against bandit signs. The reason being — I’ll be honest with you.

Let’s say, for example, you’re driving down the road. You come to red light. The chances of you sitting down and looking at your phone, and being on Facebook or Twitter are probably 80% higher than you actually looking around your surroundings at bandit signs. That’s where my social media marketing comes in.

For example, if you got one of our animation videos that we send out there that say, “Hey, we buy houses. We buy this.” You know, a friend of yours is sharing it on his Facebook page, and you’re sitting there at a red light, waiting a couple of minutes, you’re watching that 30 second video. That’s going to grab your attention, not those bandit signs.

Mitch: You know, bandit signs used to work great for me. They used to, and I used to buy houses all the time. I have a 20 year long career, and I’ve noticed it go from ultimately effective and very effective to one of the staples that I used, all the way down to where we don’t even do it anymore, because it’s not effective. Because, I think there’s been so many people putting up so many signs, and there’s been an awful lot of ineptness followed by those phone calls off those signs, that people just — they just got a bad rep, I guess.

Because, I used to buy lots of houses from those signs, and I don’t anymore. And that’s part of the evolution of investing, is things that work today, won’t work tomorrow. Markets that are here today, won’t be here tomorrow. Technology may or may not work for us today, but it probably will work for us tomorrow, if it doesn’t already because, it’s always changing. And…

Shawn: You hit the nail on the head on that one. The main thing is, you got to move along with time. As time changes, you’ve got to adapt to that particular strategy.

You know, bandit signs work great in the past, and then it just got a point that every investor was putting their sign in front of somebody else’s sign and so on and so forth. It just got so cluttered that people aren’t paying attention to it anymore.

So, you know, you’ve got to step out of the box. You’ve got to find your own little niche. You’ve got to move along with time.

Mitch: Yeah. And, you don’t just go into the social media, and figure it all out in one minute. You have to make some connections. You have to spend some time on it.

I see these people that play video games, you know, for points or little rinky-dink prizes or whatever it is they get. Or, just the pride of, “I scored more points than anyone else on this.” And, I say to myself, yeah people ask me, “Do you play video games?” And I said, “Yeah. I do. I play a game called, ‘Let’s see how much money I can make this computer crap’, and it’s called — it’s my real estate game.” And so, that’s the game I play.

I’m on there making connections. You know, I have it set up to where everyone’s happy birthday — everyone that has a “Happy Birthday” within my group that day, they all get a free 100 pages of my book or something. You know, every single one of them, every day.

And, it’s just something that I keep fortifying. I keep adding to the amount of friends I have, the amount of likes that I have. The amount of things that I can give away to these people. The amount of inventive reasons that I can connect with them, and not look or feel completely like a sales person. Ways to approach people, it not all be about business, but if they’re interested in your business, they can figure out how to backtrack to find you.

Shawn: Yeah. One of the reasons that I push on social media is because, at the end of the day, if you’ve gone to any of the investor meetings, if you’ve gone to any to any of the REIAs, the clubs, the main thing that you get out of it is it’s all about networking.

And that’s what social media is. It is a virtual network. The whole thing about real estate is you connect with others. You have to build that network. And once you build that network, then that network works for you.

Mitch: Yeah. It can be a pretty big network. You can also get visit and suggestions and help from all over a nation, now in a world, it is not the same. It is not ideal mostly in San Antonio Texas, do you deal in a regional or local market? Or are– do you deal all over The United States, Shawn? 

Shawn: Mostly, I deal in my local market, which is Houston, Texas. 

Mitch: What is your favorite strategy?

Shawn: Basically, I find properties that are close to me that I can actually keep my hands on, now, if I come across properties that sometimes are even a little bit harder to push out. Sometimes, my multifamily deals that I get, my local investors may not pick up the net from my networking and my social media marketing campaign handy, because, since I will be able to reach out to others that– let’s say for example in California, even internationally, in China, Japan, you know, I have investors that tell me, “Hey, if you come across any property, shoot to me”. Back in the days, it used to be whom we knew, that we would be able to go ahead and pitch this properties to. Now, it’s like, I can go ahead and throw the property out and I will get people from all over the world to say, “Hey, I wanna invest in that property. I wanna take that property off your hands”. So, it’s– you don’t have that broad area where you can work anymore, means you have a nationwide network, if not a global network that you can work with. 

Mitch: Yeah. Your reach can be much bigger. And you know, you don’t know who you are talking to that know somebody in the city that you are in or is great friends with him or has roots on the ground that city. So, a lot of people are doing from afar these days. I have several students myself, that owner financing strategy doesn’t work in L.A. so, there’s still–they don’t wanna move from L.A, because that’s where their lives are. But, they know they have to find a different market. So, they are doing business in Texas or Georgia, or some place that is more conducive to that niche. And so–

Shawn: That’s correct

Mitch: And because of the virtualness of our business, which there’s a lot of resources we can get online now. Pictures and Google Maps and Google Aerial views and Google Earth, I don’t know, we can go down the list of different kinds of apps that can help us from afar, inside of the house. Not to mention, that we get someone on the ground there, and mine for some people that will help us in those communities. Ultimately, you have to get some roots on the ground, just to have that last final human element of the eye. I went there. I walked through the house, it was everything you thought it was, where there are some problems that could see, you know, everyone would like to have that comfort. So, what’s the price range of the house you are doing, or– do you wholesale a lot of them or do you retail a lot of them or what?

Shawn: I mean the average price, I picked up at a house at the lowest, and you know, $33,000. I actually done a house that’s up to about $500,000. The one that I hit, $500,000 was basically, what we did was, we bought a small [INAUDIBLE] pretty much take down the [INAUDIBLE], and rehab on it, and slipped it for $500,000. Man, that was an expensive project, and the amount of stress that went to it, you cannot imagine. But, the reward, you know was there at the end of the day. And that reward and stress went out into that property. 

Mitch: I’d like to ask, what is the best deal that you’ve done and what’s the very worst that you’ve done? Is that the best deal that you have done?

Shawn: That’s the best. That’s probably the– I wouldn’t say the best deal that I’ve done, the best deal that I did was, I actually picked up, this was probably a couple of months, when I put up my property. I had a couple of small slips, and then I actually got a property, I don’t remember the exact numbers on it, it is probably a $160,000 is what I picked up the property for. And I turned around and sold it for $60,000 more, within a matter of days to another investor. I made a quick $60,000 on just wholesaling a property.

Mitch: What a businessman. You apply yourself, [INAUDIBLE] but every now and then you got a home run or grand slam. And if you are out there active, that’s gonna happen to you about once a year at least. You know, what I mean? The stars and the moon lined up, that wasn’t very painful, and everything went the way it was supposed to go. I got it under contract, and I sold it in 3-4 days, and I have a check, and I can hardly believe it. Because, we are used to be dealing with a bunch of problems, which is why we generally make our money for solving a bunch of issues, be of title issues, or you know, heirs and states, and all these other things. Every now and then, one just lives in there, and usually it’s the big one, right? That just goes–

Shawn: Exactly. And the funny thing is, the big one that came to me is right after my second project, and my second project that I was working on, man, if I go into detail with it, it was a property that I picked up through another wholesaler. I got into the property and turned out, you know i’m sitting there, waiting for one of my contractors to show up, and I kid you not, am holding backwards into the driveway and am just waiting, playing a game on my phone, and all of a sudden I looked up, there’s like 4 or 5 police cars that surrounded that house. Turns out, that house that I bought was a local drug dealing house. The cops come out ask me, “Hey, you know, we are looking for so and so. Do you know so and so”? And am like “That I think was the previous owner and we don’t have a forwarding address, you are more than welcome to contact the title company, I’ll give it to you”. So, I got my contractor in there. I mean, it was just crazy. I got my contractor in there, and we started doing the work. My contractor quoted me 2 and 1/2 months to get the whole deal done, once we got the contractor in there, 2 months turned into 3, turned into 4, am like, “OH, my god, what am I doing. Should I really signed up for this”? The other thing, this property backed up to an apartment complex, and again, you know, I didn’t do much research, I jumped in because, you know the number made sense to me. Back up to an apartment complex, we had kids always coming on, you know, [INAUDIBLE] going to the school bus, crossing over our yard, we put up a fence, fence had torn down, put up another fence, fence got torn down. I mean, the money– and I was like, “OH, my god, what’s going on”? You know, after this i’m not gonna do anymore projects but finally at the end of the day, when we ended up selling that particular property, I lost about 5 grand on that property, I was still happy. I was like, you know, “Hey, I was going to make about 30 grand, but after all the pitfalls and everything, you know, I ended up losing money on it, it’s fun. I learned– next time I’ll get a property, do a little bit more research on it. Don’t get close to apartment complex. You know, unless you are getting a super super deal. But, after that, I was like you know, “Maybe, it is not the right way to go”. And then, I picked up this property within 2-3 days, you know, I turned around and make a quick 60, I was like, “Hey, real estate is the way to go”.

Mitch: Yeah. Well, this is where I always like to address, do you think that what happened to you if you had the right mentor? Do you think you could pay the consultant on that house, $5,000 or less, you know. Because, you lost $5,000 on that house. And this is what i’m saying, finding the right mentor at the right time when you are ready to jump in, will actually save you money. ‘Cause there are 2 things that a great mentor will do. First, a great mentor will keep you on track. First, a great mentor will let you buy the deal, if it’s not a good deal. He’ll avoid you everything right then, if he doesn’t see the margin or if he has problems with apartment complexes like that, especially apartment complexes or for example, I got people that always wanna buy great deals right next to the railroad tracks, I mean right next to the road. I said, “Don’t do it, it won’t work. I tried it a hundred times. The price is great but trying to sell it, is gonna be horrible”. 

Shawn: That’s correct.

Mitch: And some of them still go ahead. And then, I get proven again. I just don’t buy houses on railroad tracks anymore. I tried it and I watched people tried it, and it’s just– I rather spend my energy in someplace else and the same thing. And so, when you get a mentor, number one, they’ll confirm your thought if it’s a good idea or they’ll deny it. That’s number one thing. Number two is, they’ll guide you to money or show you steps or introduce you to contractors or vendors that will save you a lot of money or head ache, ‘because they’ve already kind of put these people to [INAUDIBLE] process. And they’ll guide you to money, maybe that you don’t even see, or you didn’t even know that was there, extra money, extra things that you can do to add on to tack on, to extend your profits. But, the part you can never measure and you can never measure this, is how much did the mentor keep me from me from losing. Because, he is there, you don’t lose. And you’ll never know how much you didn’t lose because you had him that is an intangible fact. But, if one of the 3 things that you get from a mentor, two you can measure, one you can’t. And so– Do you have mentors, did you picked up mentors in your career? 

Shawn: Honestly, I didn’t picked up any mentors, you know, throughout my entire career. Basically, my mentor is probably my personal mentors, my parents. The struggles that they went through to bring me up, it was just basically, that was it. You know when I am ready to have my own family, I wanna make sure that they are secure, the same way my parents brought me up, is the same way you know, I would like to bring my kids up.

Mitch: Well, I understand the baseline of it all. You had a good upbringing and good morals and good ethics, but I didn’t get a mentor either. It was almost too late. I was about to walk out in my career which has been so big in my life. And so big in the lives of the people around me. I was about to walk away from that, and I was forced to hire someone because I didn’t wanna lose my good credit, and I didn’t wanna lose my good name, my reputation. And I accidentally, hired a mentor. I didn’t looked at it like that, it wasn’t what I thought I was doing. I hired this guy to help me, and he helped me. He cost me about $10,000 and it was my last $10,000, so it’s always a lot of money when it is your last money. And that person, changed the whole thing that I was doing. I was doing buy and hold, and I was a landlord, and he’s the one who introduced me to owner financing and not having to deal with all those liabilities. And it is in my story, I don’t wanna repeat my story but– and after that, I started seeking mentors. And I had a mentor or been part of a grand consortium group ever since, and it is the reason to this day, that I can buy a 100 houses a year, and not ever see them, and I can sell a 100 houses a year, and never see my buyers. And I can make loans to people and I can put stuff in my IRAs and my 4o1k. And I can do all these stuff, because I have a team and I learn how to build some systems, and I learn how not to be everything, every day to my business. And so, if you solved a problem, called lead generation, which is Shawn Mandan offers. Lead generation, or lead optimization plan, which deals with lead generation, which is the crooks of the whole business, I mean you have to get leads before you get houses. Nothing happens before that. This is the very beginning of the mountain that we have to climb and consummate to get a check. So, if you wanna check it out, you go to

, make sure that it’s all lower case. M-A-N-D-A-N at the end there., all lower case.

Man, I really want to thank you for coming on. I think it is interesting that, everyone on this whole creative real estate genre right now is saying the same thing. Man, we just can’t find any deals. That’s not true. I know it is not true. Shawn knows it’s not true. You know, people that I’ve interviewing here in real estate summit podcast, they know it’s not true. But, they are not doing the same old worn out ideas anymore. So, take a hint from Shawn Mandan, and let’s start to explore what the world of social media can do and how he’s generating leads and very viable leads using social media. Anything else you wanna add before we go, Shawn?

Shawn: No. That’s pretty much. You covered in a nutshell. You know, just the main thing is, don’t leave any lead behind. You know, even if it a lead says, no. Continue to follow up with them, you know. A lead can possibly tell you, No, just because another wholesaler maybe offering him 5 grand more than you are. But, if that wholesaler can’t close on it, you know that lead will come back to you. And now, the ball is in your court. Never leave a lead behind. Continue to follow up with them, at the end of the day, worst case scenario, you can make a friend out of it, that’s the main thing. And again, everything Mitch and I talked about, you know the lead optimization plan, you can see it on our website, and you’ll basically see all this free information that I gave away– in getting your lead. And again, Mitch, I wanna thank you so much for having me on this podcast. If you guys got any more questions, feel free to reach out. 

Mitch: I appreciate it, and it has been a pleasure and I hope you’ll have a great finish off 2016, and I hope you have great Christmas and Holidays. I appreciate that you coming on. And I will talk to you, soon. 

Shawn: Thank you so much. 


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